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| * persia is pondering proposing a code of conduct for Baserock, and wondered if others have opinions | 09:25 | |
| Kinnison | In general I think CoCs are good | 09:27 |
|---|---|---|
| jmacs | +1 | 09:28 |
| Kinnison | I have this odd argument with myself between "We're too small to need one" and "Without one, how can we hope to grow safely" | 09:28 |
| Kinnison | I'd err on the side of having one | 09:28 |
| ssam2 | seems fine if it is short | 09:28 |
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| persia | They are never short, but I'll take a survey of a few, and submit a candidate to the mailing list later in the week. | 09:30 |
| ssam2 | ah, if it's a pre-existing one that we don't need to maintain then there is less need for it to be short | 09:30 |
| petefoth_ | A good idea to have one at some point, so long as it doesn't increase friction for possible new contributors. I'm not sure we need one yet though, given the relativelky low numbers of current contributors | 09:30 |
| persia | I think of the key points as being 1) raise problems when they are known, 2) respect others, and 3) don't block others work | 09:31 |
| ssam2 | I think "assume people mean well" is key | 09:32 |
| petefoth_ | ssam2: if there is a pre-existing one that works, juts reference it, don't create a copy | 09:32 |
| * persia encourages others to share opinions of key points to help find the right document | 09:32 | |
| persia | petefoth_: Unreliable: source could change without our agreement. That said, we can create a copy using technologies that allow us to update our copy if the source changes. | 09:33 |
| persia | (if we want) | 09:33 |
| jmacs | I.e. lorry it. Sounds sensible. | 09:33 |
| petefoth_ | If it changes, check it still works for us: if not either submit changes upstream or fork | 09:34 |
| straycat | how does 3) work in practice? i've had work rejected from other projects because i was wrong, why would baserock behave differently here? | 09:47 |
| pedroalvarez | nobody looks at https://mason-x86-64.baserock.org/ these days :( | 09:54 |
| tiagogomes | Mason sending IRC notifications, would help | 09:55 |
| rjek | Could perhaps do that with a generic off-the-shelf bot and having Mason generate an RSS feed? | 09:57 |
| persia | straycat: In other projects I've worked in, 3) is mostly about being clear in communications when someone stops working on something on which others rely for their work, so that the others can step in, rather than being blocked. When something is wrong, it is wrong. | 10:02 |
| ratmice___ | not CoC stuff as its focused on patch review, anyhow I agree with all the points raised here: http://tromey.com/blog/?p=436 | 10:02 |
| straycat | persia, okay that makes sense | 10:03 |
| persia | ratmice___: Thanks! Those are all great points. | 10:03 |
| straycat | those are good points thanks ratmice___ | 10:07 |
| ssam2 | pedroalvarez: mostly because when the output gets long it causes my normal web browser to eat all my RAM | 10:10 |
| pedroalvarez | :) | 10:11 |
| * pedroalvarez will send a couple of fixes | 10:11 | |
| pedroalvarez | https://gerrit.baserock.org/#/c/975/ | 10:16 |
| ssam2 | oh, that breakage was my fault too! | 10:27 |
| ssam2 | good spot | 10:27 |
| persia | I've been watching storyboard upstream, and apparently OpenStack is running trunk, so that the fixes made by the developers end up being available quickly. | 10:30 |
| persia | Is there any way the Baserock infrastructure could have this sort of auto-update, to take advantage of recent (and ongoing) improvements? | 10:31 |
| persia | Some of storyboard upstream appears to also be in this channel, so I expect they would be responsive to any issues encountered. | 10:31 |
| SotK | persia: Do you mean auto-updating Baserock's StoryBoard instance or auto-updating all of our infrastructure? | 10:33 |
| persia | SotK: I meant only storyboard: I think we'd need a closer relationship with more upstreams to autoupdate everything. | 10:34 |
| * SotK thinks it should definitely be updated from whatever version it is currently running when someone has time, even if auto-updating isn't wanted | 10:35 | |
| paulsherwood | am i right that OpenStack is confident in trunk because of their test/ci regime? | 10:36 |
| paulsherwood | and in effect we could/should have the same level of confidence | 10:36 |
| paulsherwood | if so +1 on adopting trunk | 10:37 |
| paulsherwood | it would be an interesting use-case anyway | 10:37 |
| persia | paulsherwood: Yes, OpenStack is fairly aggressive about that, and some folk run lots of OpenStack services off trunk. | 10:37 |
| paulsherwood | so +1 | 10:37 |
| persia | So yeah, if we trust their CI/review process, then we should trust their trunk, especially since we don't have to go far to make noise if someone approves something that breaks something. | 10:38 |
| persia | That said, I don't know how aggressive the testing is for Storyboard: at least some recent patches seem to have not passed some of the non-voting tests. | 10:38 |
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| * SotK thinks that the non-voting test in question may be broken | 10:41 | |
| Zara_ | yeah, it seems the 'check-storyboard-js-integration' test always fails. | 10:42 |
| ssam2 | our current storyboard instance is a bit of a hack | 10:53 |
| ssam2 | i'll deploy anything at baserock.org that is less of a hack :) | 10:53 |
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| persia | ssam2: Shall I take that to mean that you welcome patches to the infra repo for an auto-updating storyboard? | 10:55 |
| ssam2 | yes | 10:55 |
| Zara_ | ooi, how was baserock's storyboard set up? (ie: built from a reference 'storyboard' system, or some other system with storyboard then downloaded via pip and npm and the rest?) | 10:55 |
| persia | Heh. I was hoping for something more active, but that certainly meets my needs. | 10:56 |
| ssam2 | I'm not sure that feel comfortable just pulling the latest storyboard on the current instance, it might well break, and doesn't have much of a rollback mechanism | 10:56 |
| persia | ssam2: rollback would be 1) yell at upstream, 2) pull the new HEAD of master with the revert commit | 10:56 |
| persia | (or at least, that is how OpenStack seems to do it) | 10:56 |
| ssam2 | right. I'm cagey about updating from its current state, even | 10:57 |
| ssam2 | it may have grown more dependencies, require different apache config, etc. | 10:57 |
| ssam2 | Zara: I tried to use the puppet-storyboard scripts on Fedora, which mostly worked, but I had to edit the storyboard config and apache config manually (and maybe other stuff, I forget) | 10:57 |
| ssam2 | I also tried to use a tool call Packer for this, which it turns out isn't actually very useful for us | 10:58 |
| ssam2 | as everything it does can be done by Ansible with much less faff | 10:58 |
| ssam2 | the files I used to deploy it are here: http://git.baserock.org/cgi-bin/cgit.cgi/baserock/baserock/infrastructure.git/tree/baserock_storyboard | 10:58 |
| ssam2 | but I think throwing that away and starting again is probably a good bet :) | 10:59 |
| ssam2 | one issue is that they seem to use forked versions of Puppet modules | 10:59 |
| ssam2 | another is that they clearly only test deployment on Ubuntu. I did some kind of hacking to get systemd units for the services it provides, but never got them in a state I could send them upstream | 10:59 |
| ssam2 | so, help here is much appreciated. The infrastructure is all hosted in OpenStack, so any set of build and deploy instructions that produce a Storyboard VM in OpenStack are suitable for baserock.org infrastructure | 11:01 |
| * persia wonders if the openstack-infra puppet modules could just be used entire | 11:01 | |
| ssam2 | Hopefully. Maybe the issues I found have now been resolved, or maybe someone will have time to resolve them | 11:02 |
| ssam2 | My lack of knowledge about Puppet didn't help | 11:02 |
| pedroalvarez | Ansible! | 11:03 |
| * pedroalvarez shuts up | 11:03 | |
| ssam2 | i'd prefer Ansible :) it's much easier to understand than Puppet in my opinion | 11:04 |
| persia | Ansible use in OpenStack is growing, but I don't believe infra has considered any migration yet, despite affection by many. | 11:18 |
| Zara_ | hm, would it be possible to make a dummy storyboard with the same settings as the existing one, then update that and see if things break? | 11:20 |
| persia | Possibly, although if there were manual steps, it may be difficult to achieve that. | 11:21 |
| paulsherwood | could we do the ansible approach and offer it to openstack? | 11:21 |
| persia | No: infra is very opposed to large code drops. | 11:22 |
| persia | It might be possible to do the ansible approach inside openstack infra, and adopt it though. | 11:22 |
| ssam2 | zara: that's a good idea. I can provide you with a snapshot of the current image | 11:24 |
| ssam2 | if you'd like | 11:24 |
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| Zara_ | I think it'd be good to make it available; I'm not sure if I'll have time to test it myself right now, but I might in the future, or someone else might. | 11:36 |
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| ssam2 | Zara_: makes sense, I'll put it on my list of things to do | 11:42 |
| Zara_ | :) I'm hoping it works perfectly on the first try, buuut... | 11:45 |
| ssam2 | it seems the 'run-parts' in Busybox actually has more features than 'run-parts' in Fedora | 12:06 |
| ssam2 | there's a first | 12:06 |
| ssam2 | what I want is `run-parts --exit-on-error` | 12:06 |
| ssam2 | does that feature exist in the run-parts in Debian/Ubuntu ? | 12:07 |
| ssam2 | or any other distro (Arch, Gentoo etc)? | 12:07 |
| ssam2 | seems so | 12:09 |
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| paulsherwood | itstool upstream is now officially github... https://github.com/itstool/ | 14:17 |
| * paulsherwood has sent a patch | 14:17 | |
| ssam2 | thanks! | 14:33 |
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| paulsherwood | ssam2: is that a +1 ? :) | 15:09 |
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| Kinnison | On CoCs: https://twitter.com/sarahsharp/status/621334684157382656 | 15:40 |
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| persia | She has a fairly good view of these things: she, herself, regularly plays in high-temperature communities, but receives input from a large constituency of folk who wonder how she can stand it, helping inform her insight. | 15:43 |
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| paulsherwood | anyone know why writeexts.py now tries --json as a flag on system-version-manager list? | 16:10 |
| Kinnison | It was part of some work done to allow it to detect preexisting systems | 16:11 |
| Kinnison | There were two parts, one for writeexts.py and one for system-version-manager | 16:11 |
| Zara_ | (Agree that CoCs are generally a good idea and we should have one, more to reassure new people who might read significance into the absence.) | 16:11 |
| paulsherwood | ok. this is another example of the back-n-forth problems - we can't guarantee two parts get updated at once | 16:12 |
| ssam2 | paulsherwood: does it fail if the --json flag isn't supported? | 16:18 |
| Kinnison | Based on the code I reviewed at the time, it falls back cleanly | 16:19 |
| paulsherwood | the deployment succeeds, but the backtrace is ugly | 16:28 |
| paulsherwood | i wondered if the deployment might have only succeeded because ybd may ignore error codes (i know folks have tsked about ybd's carelessness regarding errors) | 16:29 |
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| ssam2 | looking at http://git.baserock.org/cgi-bin/cgit.cgi/baserock/baserock/definitions.git/tree/extensions/ssh-rsync.check, it should neither fail nor give a backtrace to stdout | 16:55 |
| ssam2 | it'll give a backtrace to the log file, which I think is OK | 16:55 |
| ssam2 | i didn't try it though, so i could be talking nonsense | 16:55 |
| ssam2 | need to leave now, have a good evening! | 16:55 |
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| paulsherwood | gnite... that may be ybd... it tails logs to std_out on error (which seems useful for builds - this is the first time i've seen it in deploy) | 16:58 |
| radiofree | you probably want to do a sys.stdout.flush after printing | 16:59 |
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| paulsherwood | :) | 17:16 |
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