IRC logs for #baserock for Thursday, 2015-01-29

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tiagogomes_now that the morphs are in definitions and for most repos we have no delta against upstream, do we need to use a baserock/morph branch?10:14
franredtiagogomes_, only if you are going to modify the delta10:15
franredwe are updating the refs to upstream references at the same time as we update the chuncks to use newer tags/branches/commits10:16
tiagogomes_I am just wondering, if upstream rewrites history, what will happen on the trove10:17
KinnisonNominally we should anchor commits somehow in a ref upstream can't adulterate10:17
Kinnisonbut I'm semi-okay for now with tags10:17
ssam2part of the work i'm doing will include adding some way of easily creating anchor tags in delta/ repos10:19
ssam2in a way that doesn't enforce a specific tagging policy, since we didn't manage to agree on one10:20
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Kinnisonhehe10:23
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bashrc_when using morph cross-bootstrap do the individual components of the morph need to be pre-built before calling that?10:43
bashrc_(such as build-essential)10:43
KinnisonNo, cross-bootstrap sorts all that out10:43
bashrc_ok10:44
tiagogomes_hey, can someone make lorry controller start lorrying groff-git now?10:51
tiagogomes_I wonder if it would be better to prioritize automatically new lorries10:52
ssam2tiagogomes_: yeah, probably10:54
ssam2i can promote the lorry for you10:55
ssam2we could probably add a button to the public lorry-controller page to promote lorries10:55
ssam2although i guess it would need a rate limiter to avoid being used a vector for a denial-of-service attack10:55
ssam2delta/groff-git should be at the top of the queue now10:56
tiagogomes_thanks ssam2 11:03
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straycatnot sure I follow the thinking in deploy_plugin, we collect a list of error messages *and* write each line out to stderr as it occurs, we then emit the list of errors once the process exits, so you get a repeat of the err msg11:16
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straycatI think it's enough for the ext err msg to say for example, kvm.check failed with code n, the err has already been sent to stderr11:22
ssam2I guess the thinking is that a big deploy can produce a lot of output, and it's annoying having to search thru hundreds of lines for the error message11:26
ssam2remember you can deploy lots of systems from the same cluster, and they can each contain nested systems like an initramfs, and it all gets quite verbose11:26
ssam2so I like that it'll sum up the errors at the bottom11:27
straycatfair enough, it's just looks a bit weird for simple cases like this http://sprunge.us/FHWG11:31
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ssam2it does11:40
ssam2Gerrit and MariaDB are making me sad.11:44
ssam2when I start the Gerrit service, I get lots of errors about it not being able to connect to the DB11:44
ssam2but when I manually run `gerrit.war gsql`, it gives me a working SQL shell connected to the DB11:44
ssam2I've verified it's the same DB. So I guess Gerrit isn't reading its config right when I start it as a daemon :(11:45
pedroalvarez:/11:45
* CTtpollard remembers the horror of gerrit and postgres11:46
ssam2oh, maybe 'gerrit.sh -d /srv/gerrit' is the answer11:46
ssam2yay, now I get a different error11:48
tiagogomes_is it planned to speak about tarball imports in the baserock meetup? This right now is a bit messy. E.g there is a git lorry for gdbm, but according the commit log, a tarball is being used11:51
franredssam2, I think you have to tell gerrit where the database is when you init without launching the service11:51
franredyou can configure gerrit without starting with some argument: --no-autostart I think11:52
franredssam2, ^^11:52
pedroalvareztiagogomes_: I think that an RFC to the mailing list would be enough11:53
tiagogomes_pedroalvarez ok11:54
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* pedroalvarez remembers a systemd bug that is causing Trove deployments to fail12:34
ssam2which?12:39
pedroalvarezone that doesn't let you enable template systemd units.12:41
pedroalvarezWe are using that kind of units for the minions services12:42
pedroalvarezfortunately, they fixed it. So I'll cherry-pick the patch with the fix and test it.12:43
pedroalvarezand if that works, I'll send the patch for review.12:43
pedroalvarezI'd try to upgrade to v218 but I know that jjardon found some problems when trying to do so12:44
ssam2i think my gerrit systemd unit is failing because gerrit is so crazily slow to load that the unit just times out12:53
ssam2no, it's more complex :(12:53
ssam2but it takes 1 minute 35 to fail to star12:53
ssam2t12:53
ssam2and the best part is it has actually started, just the gerrit.sh script says it failed12:55
jjardontiagogomes_: Id say we should lorry when we need a tarball; so you have <package> as a mirrot of the upstream git repo and <package>-tarball if you need to lorry a tarball of that package12:55
jjardonpedroalvarez: yeah, It failed to compile here but maybe you have more luck ;)12:56
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pedroalvarezjjardon: heh, I'll give it a try.12:58
ssam21 minute 35 turns out to be a timeout value in gerrit.sh, not the actual loading time of java :)13:00
pedroalvarezwhat is it waiting for?13:00
tiagogomes_jjardon, If we used that git repository naming convention, it would be an improvement, I think13:01
ssam2pedroalvarez: the gerrit process to create /srv/gerrit/lib/gerrit.run13:07
ssam2which it never does13:07
ssam2s/lib/logs/13:08
ssam2strace shows it seems to be hanging in futex_wait() fairly early on...13:09
ssam2futex(.., FUTEX_WAIT, ..) rather13:09
ssam2after calling clone()13:09
ssam2weird thing is, it worked OK once13:10
ssam2oh, I guess that's not a hang at all, it's just forked :)13:11
ssam2strace is hard!13:11
persiastrace is best for single-threaded code :)13:12
straycatjjardon, any significant reason for updating automake, or are you just keeping us up to date?13:13
jjardonstraycat: up to date13:13
jjardonIt fixes several bugs  of minor and medium severity though; http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/autotools-announce/2015-01/msg00000.html13:15
tiagogomes_jjardon that will make doing a `autoreconf -ivf` harder13:15
jjardontiagogomes_: why?13:16
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tiagogomes_jjardon, more failures due undefined or deprecated macros. It was not  negative feedback. Just saying13:18
persiaGenerally speaking, let's strive to have definitions for as moden a system as is sensible.  It may cause some of us to have a bit more work, and a bit of rebasing pain for custom systems, but does a better job of the "reducing delta against upstream" bit that has made so many projects fail in the past.13:20
jjardontiagogomes_: No problems here building the generic system. But if that happens the sooner we fix the problem the better13:22
radiofreejjardon: have you tried building the weston system?13:22
radiofreethat tests a lot more really13:22
jjardonradiofree: nope13:23
straycatpython-tools might have to disappear for a bit seeing as it only contains pip and that's going to move into this new python-core stratum13:26
jjardonstraycat: are you planning on creating a python stratum? nice!13:29
straycatfranred suggested a python-core stratum might be useful13:29
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franredjjardon, there should be multiple python stratum in my opinion, I would like to have core and maybe tools/ at the moment I have one which is only dedicated to openstack13:31
franredstraycat, that is fine by me13:31
* straycat nods13:31
jjardonfranred: so are you going to make core depend on that python-core stratum?13:33
straycatfranred, I don't really want python-tools to go away, but morph doesn't allow empty strata13:33
straycatoh i know13:34
franredjjardon, that is my plan, have a python core stratum which is in the core stratum13:34
straycatvirtenv13:34
straycati wanted to add that anyway13:34
franredstraycat, six?13:34
franredsix is in different strata, in my patches I've added to core but maybe is better to have it in tools? not sure13:35
straycatthat's in morph-utils currently, not sure we want morph build depending on python-tools really13:35
franredumm, ok, then don't move it13:35
franredI will move it to core when I send the patches13:36
franredstraycat, ^^13:36
straycatrokay13:36
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rdale_should kvm be the standard way to run baserock on a linux host? are there any advantages/disadvantages in using virtualbox?13:51
jmacsBoth work fine in my experience13:51
radiofreei generally find qemu-kvm to be easier to use13:51
radiofreei think the baserock documentation for virtualbox is better though?13:52
rdale_hmm ok - gfinney is learning baserock and is having problems with virtualbox, and i'm wondering if it would be better to suggest switching to kvm13:52
persiaHistorically more folk have used KVM with linux, although folk using virtualbox are increasing.13:53
radiofreerdale_: what problems is he having with virtualbox?13:53
persiaTo me, the main reason virtualbox is more interesting is better vagrant support, but we never landed a VagrantBox upstream repo anywhere (there's some instrutions on how one might do this on the wiki)13:53
persiaAlso, he might get a better answer by asking directly :)13:54
rdale_yes, i am just suggesting that he joins this channel13:54
grahamfinneyI'm here13:54
jmacsgrahamfinney: What's the problem you're having with virtualbox?13:54
grahamfinneywhere do I start? :)13:55
Kinnisonpersia: The reason there's no vagrantbox stuff is probably because I did the vagrant support and I really dislike virtualbox :-)13:55
straycatI don't want to say anything bad about virtual box today.13:55
persiaKinnison: And you also couldn't find any vagrant-libvirt stuf that was both current and working?13:55
straycatSo I won't :)13:55
Kinnisonpersia: indeed13:55
Kinnisonpersia: All the stuff I found failed to work13:55
rdale_grahamfinney: can you put the 'git clone' command you ran and the output on the baserock paste bin?13:56
persiaThat was my experience.  I ended up using virtualbox for the vagrant stuff I was doing last time I needed to do vagrant stuff, but I *want* vagrant to be better :)13:56
grahamfinneyok13:56
paulsherwoodgrahamfinney: pls be precise? vbox is a well-trodden path?13:58
grahamfinneyI'll have to type it co copy/paste won't work on VBox13:59
paulsherwoodssh in?13:59
grahamfinneycos*13:59
radiofreegrahamfinney: ssh in13:59
grahamfinneyhad problems with that too14:00
radiofreewell that sounds like problem number 1 then14:00
jmacsSounds like your network is configured incorrectly14:00
persiaFor copy/paste: do you have the guest extensions installed on your host, and the right support bits for your DE?14:01
bashrc_virtualbox seems ok to me. It's slow, but then I would expect it to be.14:01
* persia thinks ssh is better, and generally prefers headless VMs, but it might be worth solving that bit also14:01
radiofreebashrc_: slow at what?14:01
persiabashrc_: Why would you expect it to be slow?14:01
radiofree^14:02
bashrc_radiofree: at everything, pretty much14:02
radiofreewhy would you expect that?14:02
radiofreehave you enabled vt-x in your bios?14:02
bashrc_because you're typically running one virtual OS inside of another14:02
bashrc_even with the bios setting14:03
radiofreehow much slower are you talking about here?14:03
persiabashrc_: WIth modern chips, nested virtualisation using any of KVM, virtualbox, or parallels has no overhead.14:03
persia(vs. normal virtualisation)14:03
radiofreethe only thing using kvm/virtualbox i bemoan these days is the lack of RAM14:04
bashrc_at least, that's my experience of running various distros inside of virtualbox14:04
radiofree(on my laptop)14:04
persiaWell, at least for SPARC, POWER, ARM, and x86.  I don't know enough about virtualisation for MIPS, SH, Tilera, Coldfire, etc. to assert the same for those.14:04
radiofreewell, i suppose if you're using ubuntu or something, the graphics side might be slower14:04
radiofrees/might/will14:04
persiaradiofree: I7ve had success with massive overallocation and lots of swap to work around that.14:04
persiaVirtual graphics is largely unsolved.  SPICE helps, but not enough.14:05
radiofreebut for baserock it should be fine, and certainly not "slow"14:05
radiofreellvmpipe in a vm works pretty well14:05
radiofreeor at least used to14:05
persiaradiofree: I think it still does: the issue is that the graphics experience is typically less than that of the host, which typically has dedicated acceleration hardware.14:06
persiaThe "solution" of which I speak is to pass primitives to the host in a way that allows the host coprocessor to deal with the rendering rather than attempting to support virtualisation there.14:07
persiaNVIDIA also has been working on some support for passing virtual slices of coprocessors into guests, but I haven't seen that beyond the demo stage yet.14:08
radiofreeif you had a machine with two gpus and vt-d you could probably use one of them for a guest14:08
persiaLast time I tried that on my machine with that particular set of features, I had unusual behaviour.14:09
persiaBut maybe I should try again :)14:09
radiofreeyes i'm sure it all just works™ now 14:10
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pedroalvarezjjardon: systemd v218 just built :/14:49
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tiagogomes_can I insert tags on unpretrify-ref?14:53
pedroalvareztiagogomes_: if the ref matches with that tag, yes14:54
pedroalvarezthe ref sha1*14:55
tiagogomes_pedroalvarez, yep, they match14:55
jjardonpedroalvarez: nice! Maybe the new toolchain made the magic?15:18
pedroalvarezjjardon: ahh, indeed, that could be it15:19
straycatIs anyone able to review this? Happy to send it to the list as well if that helps: http://sprunge.us/IPFf15:26
straycatit adds a lorry for virtualenv, which might be useful15:27
Kinnisonlooks reasonable to me15:27
Kinnison+115:27
grahamfinney_Thanks to rdale, the problems with getting the build process to work have been solved. I'm trying to grasp where it went wrong, but I'm sure it was all ME.15:28
Kinnisongrahamfinney_: If you do find a deficiency in our documentation, please feel free to augment the wiki pages in question :-)15:28
grahamfinney_I will if I can pin it down15:29
Kinnison:-)15:29
franredstraycat, looks ok to me too, +1 15:30
straycatawesome thanks!15:30
* straycat merges15:30
* straycat waits around impatiently15:31
paulsherwoodstraycat: +115:32
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straycatpaulsherwood, oh no it's already merged, i'm just impatiently waiting for lorry controller :p15:32
paulsherwoodoh, i misread. i thought you were awaiting review still :)15:32
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kejiahuhello, I've got a question about updating chunks for baserock. I tried to merge latest make onto my branch created based on baserock upstream, but lots of files got conflict. As I am not very familar with git usage, I wonder if there is a better way to merge it without manually edit every file?16:06
paulsherwoodkejiahu: have you made any changes to make, yourself?16:08
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Zara(Any chance of having a big red button on the wiki, that, when clicked, sets up a vm and gets br running on it? Not a tool for those intending to do serious work with baserock, but more for those who are a bit curious about it and want to try it out. I feel like the difficulty (or perceived difficulty) even getting set up is something which puts people off.) <- in brackets because I think it's probably a bit silly.16:09
jmacsIt's an interesting thought16:10
SotKZara: kinda like https://www.docker.com/tryit/ ?16:10
kejiahupaulsherwood, the offical make came without ./configure, so I ran autoreconf to generate one, and verified it can be built, then distcleaned the diectory16:11
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ZaraSotK: yeah, I think so. I confess I don't really know *how* it would work; whether it'd be a demo hosted on the site itself, or just effectively a link to something that'd execute and set up br with some default settings on a user's own system16:12
ssam2Zara: it might be cool to be able to do 'vagrant up baserock'. There was already some work on Baserock in Vagrant16:12
ssam2I believe the aim of Vagrant is to provide something a bit similar to the big red button you're describing16:13
paulsherwoodkejiahu: ok, so most of the patches in baserock/build-essential branch are just the morph files, which are now used from definitions.git16:13
paulsherwoodthe only actual patch is sam's import http://git.baserock.org/cgi-bin/cgit.cgi/delta/make.git/commit/?h=baserock/build-essential&id=cb07d773ed7c0b47e2d327a255b389818aebc9af16:14
ssam2make is in build-essential16:14
ssam2so it needs to be built as a tarball rather than from Git16:14
paulsherwoodi would suggest first thing to try is just edit ref: for all the make chunks in build-essential.morph16:14
ssam2rather than try to create the generated files yourself, it's probably easier to just import the latest tarball release of 'make'16:15
ssam2I suggest adding a tarball lorry for make16:15
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* paulsherwood is now confused16:15
paulsherwoodwhat's wrong with just re-applying your patch to latest make?16:16
paulsherwood(for example)16:16
paulsherwoodssam2: ^^16:16
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ssam2the 'patch' linked there is a huge kludge, in which I deleted the whole contents of the repo and replaced them with the contents of the 3.8.2 release tarball of GNU make16:16
Zarassam2: Ah, I've seen the word 'vagrant' floating around, but I didn't know anything about it. I now see there's a section about making a vagrant basebox on the wiki, but it doesn't come across as any less complicated than other baserock setups at a glance.16:17
paulsherwoodurgh. i didn't realize that16:17
Zarassam2: which isn't to say that it's not, just that it *looks* complicated and might put someone off16:17
ssam2paulsherwood: there are a few things where, as a shortcut way of building from a tarball, I committed a tarball to git16:18
ssam2and then never cleaned up16:18
paulsherwoodssam2: right, understood16:18
ssam2zara: making a basebox is complicated, but I don't think that every user needs to make their own basebox. If we were doing things 'right' you'd just clone definitions, type `vagrant up` and get a devel VM16:21
ssam2i don't know how to make that happen, though16:21
paulsherwoodssam2: what happens if we just try to build from head, instead of tarball?16:22
paulsherwood(on make)16:22
ssam2none of the autotools generated files will be there16:22
tiagogomes_failure most likely16:22
ssam2probably stage2-make will start using tools from the host and create nightmarishly undebuggable errors further down16:23
tiagogomes_even chunks in core are being built from tarballs16:23
ssam2if that works, make (stage3) will fail to build16:23
ssam2the problem is that there are a quite a lot of circular deps involved in building from Git16:23
ssam2we try to minimise how much stuff is built from tarballs, but without making build-essential enourmous, or reintroducing the 'staging filler', some stuff has to be built from tarballs16:24
* paulsherwood is not grasping this, as usual.16:24
paulsherwoodwhat's the precise difference between a tarball and a git checkout, that introduces these issues?16:25
ssam2by convention, when a project makes a tarball release, it includes various autogenerated files16:25
ssam2for autotools projects, stuff like 'configure', 'Makefile.in' etc16:25
paulsherwoodah, ok16:25
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kejiahussam2, paulsherwood, thanks, I think I've got an idea what need to do now16:27
Zara(Sotk: hahaha, I tried messing about with shell commands in the docker tutorial just to see what would happen, and it told me off: 'This is an emulator, not a shell. Try following the instructions.')16:33
jmacsZara: Same here. Did you try 'ls'?16:34
SotKZara: heh16:34
Zarajmacs: yup. it made me laugh, but it might not go down too well with someone who was genuinely not sure how to use it.16:34
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ssam2nice to see that firefox gets stuck in a busyloop trying to view gerrit. :(16:35
ssam2oh, we get there in the end16:36
radiofreekejiahu: for things like that i would tend not to bother merging with "baserock upstream"16:39
radiofreeimo "baserock upstream" (baserock/morph) is just a throwback to when we had to put the morph file in the git repo16:40
radiofreethese days you can just set the ref to the sha of some release tag in master16:40
radiofreee.g for qt5 http://git.baserock.org/cgi-bin/cgit.cgi/baserock/baserock/definitions.git/tree/strata/qt5-tools.morph16:43
radiofreethe ref is just the v5.3.2 tag, which is direct from upstream16:43
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kejiahuradiofree, yes, I agree16:48
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jjardonIve just resent the XWayland patches to the list. Mandatory picture here: http://i.imgur.com/8bZXOuT.png?1 (weston OpenGL demo launched from a X11 app (xterm) using xwayland in a weston session)17:07
radiofree:D17:07
pedroalvarezjjardon: nice17:11
tiagogomes_what is `strip: 1` does in a lorry17:17
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ssam2tiagogomes_: strips pathname components from the files extracted from a tarball, I think17:26
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pedroalvarez_ is now known as pedroalvarez_21:56
pedroalvarez is now known as pedroalvarez21:56

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