IRC logs for #baserock for Wednesday, 2014-11-19

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franredwhere is the "manual page" for lorry? in README nad in lorry wiki it says: "see the manual page for instructions on using" but I can not find it10:26
petefothfranred: I think teh information that will/should be in the man page is just the command line help10:27
paulsher1oodfranred: http://wiki.baserock.org/Trove/reference/10:27
paulsher1oodpetefoth: it took me some time to find the trove reference earlier, shouldn't it be in guides? and perhaps linked in other places too?10:28
franredpetefoth, I disagree, lorry is fairly complex to not give any example and more when you can mess up g.b.o10:28
paulsher1ood+110:29
paulsher1oodfranred: to be more precise http://wiki.baserock.org/Trove/reference/#index4h210:29
straycatmess up gbo? why do you need to use lorry on gbo?10:30
paulsher1oodstraycat: i think he meant mess up a trove10:30
straycatoh okay10:31
franredstraycat, http://git.baserock.org/cgi-bin/cgit.cgi/baserock/baserock/lorry.git/tree/README10:31
franredif you have push access to g.b.o you could mess it up testing lorry10:32
petefothfranred: paulsher1ood: there is currently a ‘Story’ to ‘improve’ that page. In the meantime it  might be worth adding paulsher1ood’s link to the README10:32
franredIm about testing a patch to upgrade git, I want to test that we can lorry without errors with the new version so rather than deploy a trove Im going to try to use lorry.10:33
* straycat nods10:34
straycatI'm not sure you can do damage with the defaults anyhow, since it's ssh://gitano@roadtrain.codethink.co.uk/delta rather than gbo, but I may be wrong10:36
straycatIn any case you can obviously use --pull-only10:37
Kinnisonroadtrain?!10:37
Kinnisonmeep10:37
Kinnisonthat is a long long time ago10:37
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straycatyeah i have no idea what that is10:38
Kinnisonit's a server from before we even had the concept of a trove10:38
Kinnisonthe roadtrain had a lot of lorries on it10:38
Kinnison*baddumtish*10:38
straycatbahahahah.10:38
straycat>.>10:38
straycatso maybe we should patch lorry so that it doesn't have default push urls and so can't do any damage10:38
straycat(not that I'm saying it can do damage as it is)10:39
Kinnisonwell default push urls to things which don't exist are what it currently has10:39
Kinnisonthat seems fairly safe10:39
straycatokay10:40
franredstraycat, I would like to use also push, so Im looking if I can push into the same machine Im pulling the repo10:40
pedroalvarezfranred: hmm... then you have to run a git server in the machine as well10:41
straycatyou can push straight to git repos10:41
straycatlocally10:41
pedroalvarezoh yeah10:41
franredcool, I can do that10:42
franredthanks straycat :)10:42
richard_mawalso, there's a git server that comes with git10:43
* richard_maw uses it in the test suite10:43
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bashrcI can add some hashes to the baserock images, but folks will need to keep them up to date when new images are released10:43
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ssam2bashrc: that'd be good. we need to have this done as part of the release process. I'm not sure what state the release process is in at the moment, we did a lot of work on automating it a while back10:45
bashrcyes really it should just be part of a release script10:45
pedroalvarezsigh... I didn't spend time working out how these scripts work since I always think we are stopping of doing releases10:47
bashrcnever release anything. I guess that's one way of dealing with the problem10:50
jmacsdoffm_: Are you around?10:51
paulsher1oodpetefoth: /win 3010:51
paulsher1oodbah!!!!!10:51
paulsher1oodnow folks know i talk to petefoth, and have 30 windows :-)10:51
bashrcso is the plan to always build from source and not have any images?10:51
paulsher1oodyes10:52
* straycat has 31 windows10:52
paulsher1oodbut images are created, of course :-)10:52
straycat(in case anyone was wondering)10:52
paulsher1oodstraycat: i have more than that :-)10:52
rjekpaulsher1ood: Talking to petefoth is indeed a huge stigma that you will now have to live with ;-)10:52
petefothIt’s OK - petefoth doesn’t listen, and only has 9 windows10:52
* rjek grins.10:53
Kinnisonstraycat: I have around 18 channels and somewhere approaching 60 queries currently10:53
straycatI'm glad I know all this :)10:53
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richard_mawI've gotten two +1s to my runtime-depends patch, are we in agreement that we want it now?11:58
pedroalvarezI guess it would have -1's otherwise12:00
richard_mawit was a contentious issue at one point, so I thought I'd best check first12:01
franredrichard_maw, I though was paulsher1ood the one who was concern about it12:08
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franredmaybe it is worth to check with him if that concerns has been disappeared12:09
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paulsher1oodi still don't see the point, to be honest.... richard_maw - is there an urgent need for this?12:27
paulsher1oodif there isn't, i would like to throw my ybd experiment onto the list, and see if the srtucture i'm proposing addresses the need, or not?12:28
paulsher1oods/structure/definitions structure/12:28
straycatthe need is that we end up including build dependencies in the resultant system afaics12:29
richard_mawno urgent need yet, except that there's a trend towards splitting strata up (see lorry as the latest); I was just a little annoyed that it's sitting in review and hasn't been merged12:29
straycatrichard_maw, sorry for not being able to get around to it :(12:30
paulsher1oodrichard_maw: ok, if i may, i'll send an RFC on the ybd stuff today, and see whether you refute it, or see merit in adopting some of it12:31
richard_mawpaulsher1ood: and stratum runtime-depends would allow us to handle the split up strata nicely now, but there'd be more implementation time required to have your ybd format definitions12:31
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jjardonrichard_maw: an example system using the capabilities of your branch would be helpful13:14
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paulsher1ooddoes the current jetson flash script mentioned on http://wiki.baserock.org/guides/baserock-jetson/ include max sizing? 14:03
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paulsher1oodhmmm... the instructions at http://wiki.baserock.org/guides/baserock-jetson/ no longer work...14:09
pedroalvarezpaulsher1ood:  at what point do they fail?14:11
paulsher1oodpedroalvarez: sadly, at a point last edited by you :-)14:11
pedroalvarezyeah, I know that14:11
pedroalvarez:)14:11
pedroalvarezthat's why I'm asking14:11
paulsher1oodcd baserock... do stuff.. then ./flash... but flash is in the directory above14:12
pedroalvarezah! ok14:12
paulsher1oodcd .. doesn't work...14:12
paulsher1oodError: missing system image14:12
pedroalvarezoh yeah, I know what it is14:12
paulsher1oodshould the flash script be in the baserock directory?14:13
pedroalvarezThe problem is that it should be "./baserock-jetson-flash.sh /full/path/to/Linux_for_Tegra/baserock/baserock-current-build-system-armv7lhf-jetson.img"14:13
paulsher1oodafter cd ..14:14
paulsher1ood?14:14
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pedroalvarezyes14:14
paulsher1oodok i'll try it, and fix?14:14
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pedroalvarezpaulsher1ood: could you fix it if that works?14:15
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pedroalvarezmaybe we can do something clever with `curl` instead of `cd`ing to directories, etc14:20
doffm_jmacs: I'm here.14:27
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fayck fay_14:32
fay is now known as fay_14:33
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jmacs_doffm_: Hi. We're having some IRC problems here14:35
jmacs_doffm_: I was just wondering if you can remember the work you did with ceph a year ago. I found your ceph.configure file but wasn't sure what state it was in, whether you had an example of it working, for example14:36
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doffm_I can vuagely remember.14:49
doffm_I14:49
doffm_jmacs_: I'll check if I have an example cluster file. 14:49
jmacsdoffm_: That would be useful.14:52
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paulsher1oodpedroalvarez: i've fixed it, i think15:10
doffm_jmacs: I can't seem to find an example. Sorry. Not sure it would work a year later anyway, given updates to ceph in that time.15:17
doffm_The configuration script seems moderately well documented.15:18
jmacsYeah, the configuration script is good15:18
pedroalvarezpaulsher1ood: it shouldn't be "baserock-14.40.1-devel-system-armv7lhf-jetson.img"15:18
jmacsThere must be some manual configuration work needed to set up the cluster after it's deployed though?15:18
pedroalvarezpaulsher1ood: (when calling the flash script)15:19
doffm_jmacs: I believe there was ONE step that had to be performed on the running instances. For the life of me I can't remember what. I'll try and find the e-mail.15:19
paulsher1oodpedroalvarez: i didn't touch that bit.15:20
paulsher1oodi guess so. i'll retry with the latest image, then? :-)15:20
jmacsI can set up ceph clusters, that's not a problem - it's just that my way needs several more steps to set up, and you seem to be doing it in a simpler way which I don't quite understand15:20
doffm_I'll send you the e-mail that I sent with the patch. Me of 1 year ago probably understood this better.15:21
jmacsCheers15:22
doffm_jmacs: In general though the ceph-deploy script uses ssh to run commands on the nodes. The ceph configure script runs the same commands (Or similar) but at configure time rather than on the running instance.15:27
doffm_Thats a bit hacky, but lots of the commands just create data directories or install auth keys, so for many it wasn't a problem.15:28
doffm_The magic is in the ceph init scripts. The init script starts daemons based on the existance of data directories.15:29
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doffm_So the script just creates them and lets the ceph init script bring up the correct daemons.15:29
doffm_Most of the script is just moving configuration files, auth files to the right places and creating the data directories.15:30
doffm_jmacs: Unfortunately ceph-deploy went through a BIG change this last year. The init scripts / data dir locations might have changed also. I hope not, but you never know.15:32
jmacsRighto. Well, ceph still works. It's just the automation of setup that we need to finish.15:33
jmacsThanks for the email.15:34
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bashrcis baserock 14.40 recent ?15:51
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pedroalvarezbashrc: it is from the week 40 of the year 201415:52
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bashrcI'll take that as a yes15:52
pedroalvarezis from 6 weeks ago15:52
pedroalvarezwe released 14.46 last week15:53
bashrcrequires 40G, and yet the install guide creates a 30G system #seemsinconsistent15:54
pedroalvarezwhy 40G?15:55
pedroalvarezI used to use a 30G disk, but I had to clean up very often15:55
bashrc"/tmp/morph_tmp requires 4000000000 bytes free, has 1048940544"15:55
pedroalvarezthat is 4G15:56
bashrcoh15:56
paulsher1oodbashrc: did you remember ln -sv /src/morph.conf /etc/morph.conf15:58
paulsher1ood?15:58
paulsher1oodoh, ignore me15:58
paulsher1ood /ignore off 15:59
paulsher1oodbashrc: use cycle.sh - it will clean up for you :)15:59
ssam2bashrc: paul was right first time, in fact16:02
bashrcstrange. /dev/sda is only 6G. I thought I'd fallocated 3016:02
ssam2bashrc: morph unpacks whole systems into its tmpdir, so using /src/tmp (so that it isn't an in-memory tmpfs) is recommended16:02
paulsher1oodbashrc: we normally have a separate device for source?16:03
ssam2bashrc: the default /etc/morph.conf found on http://wiki.baserock.org/quick-start/#index4h2 takes care of setting the correct tmpdir location, make sure you followed that (and the instructions in the previous section for setting up a separate /src partition, as paul points out)16:04
richard_mawpaulsher1ood: I thought you were only going to show us what your proposed changed definition syntax would be16:06
bashrcso, the instructions on http://wiki.baserock.org/devel-with fail16:08
straycatbashrc, can you be more specific?16:08
paulsher1oodrichard_maw: i did that previously, i thought? 16:09
paulsher1oodthen i was guided to produce poc code16:09
paulsher1oodmaybe i misunderstood16:10
bashrcentering the commands up to morph --verbose build systems/base-system-x86_64-generic.morph doesn't build16:10
richard_mawmy understanding of my own comments at least was that I'd look forward to seeing your poc16:10
paulsher1oodbashrc: please paste output16:10
paulsher1oodrichard_maw: well now you can :-)16:10
richard_mawthe bit to convert definitions to your proposed new format is the bit I'm after16:11
bashrcERROR: Insufficient space on disk:16:11
bashrc        /tmp/morph_tmp requires 4000000000 bytes free, has 104894054416:11
bashrcPlease run `morph gc`. If the problem persists increase the disk size, manually clean up some space or reduce the disk space required by the tempdir-min-space and cachedir-min-space configuration options.16:11
paulsher1oodrichard_maw: https://github.com/devcurmudgeon/ybd/blob/master/morph-converter.sh16:12
bashrcalso the 30G drive appears to be missing16:12
pedroalvarezbashrc: have you followed  http://wiki.baserock.org/quick-start first?16:12
bashrcdo I need to mount it?16:12
richard_mawpaulsher1ood: was already trying that out before you posted the link16:12
paulsher1oodbashrc: please check have you followed the instructions at http://wiki.baserock.org/guides/no-frills/ ?16:12
bashrcok it looks like I didn't set up the second disk16:13
paulsher1oodrichard_maw: note i haven't done anything fancy like moving directories around yet16:13
paulsher1oodso 'systems' are still in systems directory, etc. but they are no longer different from 'strata' or 'chunks' in this scheme16:14
paulsher1oodbashrc: i'm interested to know how that happened? we've seen an example already this week where something on the wiki was wrong... did you follow a page that didn't cover it?16:14
richard_mawpaulsher1ood: I feel this is useful for the renaming discussion, but in its current state not so useful for debating whether we need runtime depends, which I understood to be the main point for posting the code16:18
paulsher1oodit's the main point for posting the code *now*, but not in general16:19
paulsher1oodi'm suggesting contents are in at runtime, build-depends are not. 16:19
paulsher1oodi still don't understand what runtime-depends is except that they need to be present at runtime?16:20
* paulsher1ood admits, he may be being very obtuse here... having failed to grasp the concept properly after several discussions and emails16:21
richard_mawI've tried to communicate this point before in my responses to the e-mails. In my model we have a separation between runtime-depends and chunks because how they are referred to is different. In your model runtime depends and chunks are put together in the contents list.16:21
richard_mawSo we're both agreeing on the need for runtime-depends hopefully16:22
paulsher1oodyes. is there some weakness in my model from your pv?16:22
richard_mawI don't agree that build-dependencies listed in the definition should be applied to runtime-depends16:22
paulsher1ood'applied to'?16:23
richard_mawmy understanding of your model, is that if you have build-depends in a definition then all the entries in your contents list have the build-depends that you've listed added to their list of build-depends16:23
paulsher1oodcorrect16:24
paulsher1oodwhich is what currently happens in morph, i think?16:24
richard_mawyes, but that's because we only allow chunks in there16:25
paulsher1oodin which part? a stratum's build-depends include strata?16:25
richard_mawwe only have chunks in the "chunks" field which will become "contents"16:26
paulsher1oodright16:26
paulsher1oodin my model any build depend could be a single component, or a set16:27
richard_mawthat's fine, and I want to be able to do that16:27
richard_mawI'll try to put together an example where I think this will cause problems16:27
paulsher1oodok. if i'm being obtuse, sorry for the confusion16:28
richard_mawat least you're giving me lots of opportunity to get used to my new keyboard16:28
paulsher1ood:-)16:29
radiofreeok, so i've got the flashing script working to create a ext4 boot partition, and then flash the btrfs image to mmcblk0p2, and it boots16:35
bashrcbuilding...16:35
radiofreei'm thinking of adding a BOOTFS_PATH="/dev/mmcblk0p1" to morph/system-version-manager16:36
radiofreesince this could be used in a generic way (i.e any u-boot system that doesn't have btrfs)16:36
paulsher1oodwould that be ok for non-u-boot systems too?16:37
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paulsher1oodshould/could the name make it clear it's u-boot only?16:37
radiofreesystem-version-manager is very extlinux.conf focused, as long as the bootloader can look for /extlinux.conf in whatever the boot partition is, then yes, i don't see it being a problem16:37
radiofreepaulsher1ood: it could be used for other things in the future16:38
radiofreerichard_maw: are you happy with BOOTFS_PATH before i start down that road/16:39
pedroalvarezindeed is very extlinux.conf focused, I'd be ok with it supporting u-boot as well instad of modifying u-boot to read an extlinux.conf file16:39
paulsher1oodcool then :)16:39
richard_mawAAAAAAAAaaaaaa too many things happening at once!16:39
richard_mawwhat does BOOTFS_PATH *do*?16:39
radiofreepedroalvarez: we don't need to modify u-boot, u-boot already supports that16:40
paulsher1oodrichard_maw: welcome to my world :-)16:40
pedroalvarezradiofree: does it? I thought we patched it.16:40
radiofreerichard_maw: sorry, BOOT_DEVICE, not BOOTFS_PATH16:41
radiofreeit's the cousin of ROOT_DEVICE16:41
richard_mawwhat does BOOT_DEVICE *do*?16:41
radiofreei.e system-version-manager will check for BOOT_DEVICE and use that for updating the extlinux.conf16:41
radiofreeelse, use whatever is mounted at /16:41
radiofree(current behaviour)16:41
radiofreepedroalvarez: we patched u-boot to support reading extlinux.conf from a btrfs partition16:42
pedroalvarezahh16:42
radiofreeif a wandboard has u-boot with the ums command on it (probably?) you could use BOOT_DEVICE to allow a wandboard to be upgraded as well16:42
radiofreeums command is not essential, as long as you can partition it with a BOOT_DEVICE and ROOT_DEVICE it would work16:43
richard_mawso when it goes to update /extlinux.conf and copy the kernel somewhere the bootloader can read it, rather than mounting env.get(ROOT_DEVICE, get_device_of(/)), it mounts BOOT_DEVICE to a tempdir and updates the kernels and extlinux.conf relative to that path, rather than the mounted ROOT_DEVICE?16:43
radiofreesame goes for any arm board16:43
radiofreerichard_maw: exactly16:43
radiofreei'll use the same file structure as well, since that's quite nice16:43
richard_mawin the absence of being able to use the same partition for /boot and /, due to btrfs in u-boot reliability issues, it looks like a workable solution16:45
richard_mawI'm just a little concerned about the interactions of where it gets used at write time16:45
richard_mawsince ideally you could use BOOT_DEVICE, ROOT_DEVICE and a field describing the partition structure to handle this without requiring you to say which dev-board16:46
radiofreeyou could probably do that by just setting the BOOT_DEVICE and ROOT_DEVICE? BOOT_DEVICE="/dev/whateverthebootpartitionisonaboard" ROOT_DEVICE="/dev/myrootfspartition"16:48
richard_mawyou'd have to work backwards from the device names to know which partition numbers they are16:48
richard_mawand you're not describing how large to make the partitions16:48
richard_mawnor what fs to make them16:49
richard_mawthough we can assume BOOT=ext2 and ROOT=btrfs for nwo16:49
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richard_mawpaulsher1ood: I attempted to write up my thoughts in http://paste.baserock.org/idupejawex.md16:58
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* paulsher1ood goes to sit in a corner and properly engage cpu17:00
richard_mawit's a bit straw-manny because I've been unable to get a full comprehension of what your proposal is17:00
paulsher1oodrichard_maw: why does *anything* have build-essential as contents, unless you want the build tools in the target?17:01
richard_mawbecause it contains essential system libraries17:01
richard_mawlibgcc.so comes from gcc17:02
richard_mawthere's also zlib in there because parts of build-essential require it17:02
paulsher1oodtaking second first, zlib could be in build-essential (for building) and in core, as contents if required?17:03
paulsher1oodregarding libgcc - tht is a subset of gcc 'chunk' at the moment?17:04
richard_mawpaulsher1ood: I think we'd need to drastically split up build-essential in ways morph can't currently handle for that; it may be possible but it's too much of a shift for me to contemplate at the moment17:05
paulsher1oodi think in my model gcc is in build essential, and a subset (one or more products of gcc as they are called currently?) is in core or foundation or whatever17:05
richard_mawpaulsher1ood: how exactly, your current proposal doesn't handle artifact splitting17:06
paulsher1oodonly because i haven't implemented it yet... it's not that hard, i think?17:07
richard_mawwell, supposing you split up definitions sufficiently that you could include libgcc as contents and have your definition include gcc-compiler as a build-depend17:08
richard_mawin my understanding of this, you'd end up saying that to build gcc, you need to build gcc17:09
paulsher1ooddon't you? :-)17:09
richard_mawalso, many things sound easy until you start to implement them, then they require a complete redesign of the model17:09
paulsher1oodyou do, i think. unless you've already built it. 17:09
paulsher1oodi17:09
paulsher1oodi think i've already implemented the redesign of the model17:10
richard_mawmy point is you may need to do it again to handle artifact splitting17:10
paulsher1oodit's the hard deep linux foo that beats me :-)17:10
paulsher1oodrichard_maw: no i don't think so.17:10
richard_mawyou won't know that until you start to implement it17:10
paulsher1oodagreed. but i'm quietly confident :-)17:11
* paulsher1ood has been wrong before, of course17:11
richard_mawthat's fine, but claiming that a model is the solution to all our problems, when it hasn't taken into account some of the problems our current model is currently solving is… frustrating to deal with17:12
paulsher1oodheh17:12
paulsher1oodi'm not saying i have a solution to all problems. i'm saying i have solutions to some problems. 17:12
richard_mawwhich is fine, it's just causing difficulty when attempting to find merge points in the models17:14
paulsher1oodto try to simplify what i've said already.. i'm raising this because you are proposing to *add* complexity to a model which imo is already too complex. if others agree with you, fair enough17:16
* Kinnison notes that often the first step in simplification is to add a required complication17:16
paulsher1oodnot in my worldview :-)17:17
Kinnisonpremature optimisation is an evil not a good.17:17
paulsher1oodthat's a fair generalization, not sure how it applies here, though.17:18
ssam2my experience is that artifact splitting made a lot of things a bit more ugly17:18
ssam2but we do need it17:18
ssam2I don't think the way we expose it to the user is very good, yet17:19
paulsher1oodwhere do we use it exactly?17:19
ssam2in the minimal system17:19
ssam2we don't use it nearly enough, or our devel systems wouldn't be 1.5GB17:19
paulsher1oodso, frankly, we don't use it. 17:19
ssam2I seem to recall a time when you were very pleased that Richard Maw had made a Baserock system that ran and was only 28MB17:20
ssam2that was done with artifact splitting17:20
paulsher1oodwe've proved it can work... but we don't use it17:20
paulsher1oodi'm not saying we don't need it. just that in practice it is not used17:20
ssam2ok, but i'm not sure that's a helpful comment since what matters is whether we need it :)17:21
richard_mawthat's because the project it was going to be required for ended abruptly17:21
paulsher1oodanyway, i should getback to digesting richard_maw's example17:21
pedroalvarezartifact splitting is being used in the initramfs system, and we are  using it17:21
ssam2personally i'm very sad that our systems are 1.5GB, a good portion of which is debug info that could be stripped and supplied separately17:22
pedroalvarezso am I17:22
paulsher1oodok, i was not aware of that. it's not in any of the systems i am using (devel, build, base, genivi) afaik17:22
richard_mawI suppose my main point re: runtime dependencies, is that both our models allow it, it's just that we're expressing it differently, and that I feel that paulsher1ood is conflating complexity of model with complexity of implementation.17:22
paulsher1oodrichard_maw: you may be right17:23
paulsher1oodrichard_maw: could you email your example to the list, so it doesn't get lost in traffic?17:24
richard_mawok17:24
paulsher1oodtvm17:24
richard_mawthough I think we got a bit sidetracked on that, rather than focussing on the idea of whether runtime-depends need to be in the model17:24
paulsher1oodwell, if you send your example as reply to my email, it's part of the RFC i am seeking17:26
bashrcwhat's the preferred way of getting the kernel source?17:26
richard_mawfor which purpose17:26
paulsher1oodrichard_maw: you and others are welcome to proceed with runtime-depends anyway ... i think you have +217:27
paulsher1oodbashrc: assuming you're in definitions, 'morph edit linux-x86-64-generic' for example would work i think17:27
richard_mawif it's just to look at a `git clone` would work17:29
paulsher1oodthat too :-)17:29
richard_mawif you then want to build it, then either `morph edit`, or clone locally and find where the system you're building has its definition for linux, and change the (repo, ref) to (file://path/to/local/clone, HEAD)17:30
* paulsher1ood gets email from Amazon 'Can you answer this question from a fellow customer about Acer CB5... 'can you play sims 3/4 on this?'17:31
* richard_maw snorts17:32
richard_mawperhaps the Android versions that aren't reall the sims 3 or 4, they're just branded the same17:32
* rjek giggles.17:32
* paulsher1ood wants to tell them to answer their own support questions17:32
paulsher1ood(expletives deleted)17:32
rjekheh17:33
pedroalvarezI wonder when should I do `mount -o loop` and when just `mount`17:33
richard_mawyou could probably do it with wine, but you'd need to buy your own windows licence, for a device that can't run windows, for that to be legal AIUI17:33
Kinnisonpaulsher1ood: welcome to the electric monks17:33
pedroalvarezis the former to mount files and the latter to mount devices?17:33
richard_mawyep17:33
Kinnisonpedroalvarez: in theory you need -o loop whenever you need to mount a file as a device17:33
pedroalvarezright17:33
pedroalvarezbecause both work in both cases17:34
Kinnisonpedroalvarez: the 'loop' refers to /dev/loopN which is the kernel's "loopback" block device17:34
richard_mawthough I think util-linux mount is smart about it17:34
KinnisonIt is17:34
pedroalvarezit is17:34
pedroalvarez:)17:34
Kinnisonpedroalvarez: please may I have my braincell back?17:34
pedroalvarezKinnison: only 5 minutes more please17:34
juergbirichard_maw: why would you need a windows license for wine? or am i misunderstanding what you wrote?17:35
pedroalvarezthen I guess I should support both cases even if we are using util-linux now17:35
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richard_mawjuergbi: you understood what I wrote correctly, I don't know the details, but that's what I've been told.17:36
Kinnisonpedroalvarez: So long as this time you brush the fluff and hair off  before you return it17:36
pedroalvarezKinnison: braincells with hair?17:37
KinnisonI have no idea what you did with it last time17:37
pedroalvarezheh17:38
* pedroalvarez continues mounting things17:38
juergbirichard_maw: afaik, it's perfectly legal to use wine without windows license - assuming you don't replace wine libraries with microsoft dlls from a windows installation17:38
richard_mawI think redistributable binaries provided by various applications are restricted to distribution for Windows.17:38
juergbisuch restrictions may exist but i don't think that's a very common issue17:40
juergbialso, distribution license is not an issue if you install an application that has been distributed by someone else17:41
richard_mawheh, so wine's existance means that you could force EA to violate a redistributable license by not checking whether a game is being installed in wine17:41
juergbiit would probably be sufficient if they include the same restriction in their license agreement17:45
juergbibut i would expect it to be an installation restriction, not distribution restriction17:45
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juergbianyway, there is not much i need wine for anyway17:46
* richard_maw uses it occasionally for games when the Linux native ones aren't satisfying, and an application for configuring a switch17:47
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straycatpedroalvarez, do you know anything about 6f46308dcc457b258b1f7f8f7b6eb2873d598de5 ?18:27
straycat(in definitions)18:27
straycatI rebased at some point and now I have it in my history, yet I don't see it in master18:28
pedroalvarezI can't access to that commit18:28
pedroalvarezwhat is the log message for it?18:28
straycathttp://sprunge.us/KVih18:29
jmacsNo, it's not there18:29
pedroalvarezah, that might be in the latest release branch18:29
straycatso master and the release diverged?18:30
straycat*have18:30
pedroalvarezyes, the release normally need some fixes that can't be merged on time18:30
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straycatokay, should the change not be in master as well?18:31
pedroalvarezI think it is now in master18:31
straycatit isn't, unless you've just put it there18:31
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straycati based off the release so i could build more quickly18:32
pedroalvarezstraycat: http://git.baserock.org/cgi-bin/cgit.cgi/baserock/baserock/definitions.git/commit/?id=d3d894d1f06d64005086b4b0c15ba2e8350ffd3318:32
pedroalvarezis not the same change, but equivalent18:32
straycatoh, fair enough18:32
pedroalvarezyou can base your work off master now that we have mason populating the cache of 85.199.252.9318:33
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straycati wonder if it would be better to merge the release branch next time18:33
straycatpedroalvarez, yeah i didn't think of that18:33
straycatanyhow i can safely drop this commit now18:34
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radiofreehmm19:04
radiofreesubprocess.check_call(['btrfs', 'subvolume', 'snapshot', orig_dir, run_dir]) is throwing an exception on my system :\19:04
radiofreei ran the command manually and it worked19:04
radiofree("'list' object is not callable",) oO19:10
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jmacsLooks OK to me19:11
radiofreei didn't touch that line either, i *have* made some modifications to system-version-manager19:11
radiofreebut... i don't see why it's failing there19:12
radiofreehmm maybe it's not there..19:16
radiofreeit's probably my fault, i'll try again tomorrow19:21
radiofreei bet this has something to do with this being a weird genivi image...19:23
radiofreei'll try with a devel image tomorrow19:23
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paulsher1oodradiofree: could orig_dir or run_dir be something unexpected?21:38
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radiofreepaulsher1ood: no i had them printed out22:06
radiofreeit's almost certainly a change i made though22:06
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paulsher1oodsame here :-)22:08
radiofreepaulsher1ood: i was testing having it upgrade when /boot is on a different partition, not too much to go i think, should be able to send patches tomorrow for testing22:09
paulsher1oodcool22:10
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radiofreepaulsher1ood: would requiring an sd card to to the initial flash be ok?22:39
radiofreethat way we could use the entirely open-source tools available22:39
* straycat looks at ybd22:55
straycat(in case anyone was wondering)22:55
* straycat is suddenly reminded of http://sackheads.org/~bnaylor/spew/away_msgs.html22:56
radiofreeyoung british designers?22:57
straycatno it's a prototype for a new morph that paulsher1ood has been working on22:58
straycat(yaml build deploy)22:58
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straycatpaulsher1ood, Do you think you could include some example uses on how its meant to be used? Or base it on cliapp so we can easily find help for the commands?23:25

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